I had to wait a week and read this again before commenting.
When I worked in the dining room at TFL [not FL] the service was intentionally reserved but personality encouraged. This was in years 3 and 4 ['96-97.] When I was working front [menu prez and order taking] I gave everything I had and put my heart and soul into it. Expectations were high, but there were no Michelin stars. There were a few good print reviews and the customers mostly were true diners who came for a great experience.
Even if you are highly experienced and have eaten all over, unless you've worked in a place like TFL, it's not easy to understand the choices that have to be made to run that restaurant and why. I have not eaten there since 1999, so I can't say exactly what the experience would be like today.
A few thoughts:
1. Corkage. If you could imagine the absolute torture we were put through by locals, wine makers, the famous and the wannabe famous who would show up with 10 wines for 4 people and expect to have corkage waived. And to have us clean 40 fancy wine glasses to boot. It was a nightmare for the managers to decide who paid, how many fees to charge etc,...Corkage was $10 IIRC. So eventually, they went to a fixed price, no VIP corkage fees waived. If you look at the cost of storing a wine list like theirs, you'd see they can't afford to have you bring your own wine and open it for free.
2. I've heard this has changed, but in my time, there was no music. The ambience was only the noise of the customers and service staff. Early in the service this made some diners uncomfortable. If like those seated near you [you were on table 8 in the small room I think with two other small tables] were having a bad patch in their relationship or in over their heads, it could affect your experience negatively. Thankfully sounds like some people got some wine down in the main dining room and things loosened up. The impact on your experience may not have.
3. How many restaurants like TFL have been open for 30 years? Or even the 20 when you were there? Some choices need to be made about consistency vs innovation. Thomas will feature new dishes from his cooks, but stays close to tradition. I would want Oysters and Pearls and Tongue and Cheek if I go back next year...
4. If you eat the bread, you are doomed to not enjoy much from the cheese course on....I know it's difficult because it's so good. I used to warn people.
5. Fact: even if you understand what they're doing, it doesn't mean you'll have a transcendent experience. I'd love to go back in the future, now that I've been out of restaurants for a long time and see how I feel.
Thanks for the encouraging, humorous and sincere take on your visit. I would still encourage anyone who is interested and can afford it to have a go.
John - You've tossed out a bunch of fantastic industry insights here! This is downright fantastic.
Makes sense about the corkage fee. The unwritten rule (or so I thought) was that if you bring a bottle of your own wine to a restaurant, it had to be REALLY f&^%ing special for a special occasion. This is NEVER intended to be a BYOB situation. Sounds like the 10-wines thing was a true abuse of an older custom. I'll have to ask some of my somm friends what the current state of corkage is for FOH. But I would NOT want to have to polish 40 wine glasses. Ugh. Kill me now. Thanks, John. - Seth ✦
OMG. You went to the Good Place. Yet, it sounded like it was a Mediocre Place. I always wanted to go, Michael! Sorry to hear that FOH was all Stepford, which sounds creepy. Brilliant call on the Austrian Riesling, but the $50 corkage fee AFTER already ordering from the wine menu was a complete party foul. You were there during its heyday, and hopefully even the mediocre and unsettling memories were priceless. Bravo and thanks for sharing this with the rest of us -- especially those like myself who are 3,000 miles away from Yountville. - Seth ✦
I think I was more annoyed about the fact that I had gotten Keller & Cann Hamilton a last minute table at our very busy restaurant, where their meal was fully comped without so much as a "thank you" than anything.
My annoyance about the corkage ultimately wasn't about the corkage at all.
I once called Larry Nadeau, long time M’aitre d’ at TFL, to arrange a reservation for a colleague and some business guests on short notice. It was the one and only time I used that connection and asked for a favor. Larry somehow accommodated it on an oversold weekend night.
They no-call, no-showed. And I found out from Larry directly. The colleague brushed me off like it was nothing and didn’t apologize.
I am still mad at him today, almost 15 years later.
Oh, wow. What a terrible person (I’m putting it mildly here). And incredibly generous on your part to use such a connection, John. Yeeeeesh. I’d still be pissed too. You just don’t pull that sort of stunt, no matter what. - Seth ✦
Why, now I've read that and I don't need to go! Thank yew! (If you ever come here though, Dakar! Worth the money plus you get to say "Dakar" like that NPR reporter.)
"When we visit, we pack our emotional baggage full of inflated expectations and drag it behind us through the little garden and across the front door’s threshold. It is the one thing the hostess who greets you is unable to check."
Someone needed to burst this blister and I am so glad it was you. For the record, though I don't make a habit of visiting these gastroshrines, I did eat at 11 Madison Park a few years ago when it was at its peak, and the waiters were so intuitive and responsive -- they picked up that we had a sense of irony and genuinely had fun with that (the giggles increased with each course), while expertly engaging on an entirely different plane with the neighboring table. No matter how good the food is, the service is ultimately why one spends the extra $$$ on such places. No disrespect to the waitstaff, but management has to set the expectations. Thank you for nailing the tail on the donkey.
It was a juicy blister to lance, to put it in delicious culinary terms.
To no one's surprise, I fully agree with you about service. Years ago, I went with some friends to The Flying Saucer, a very trendy spot in the 90s. We stood at the front desk for minutes as the hostess gave us the stink eye and continued chatting with a co-worker. I told my companions I wanted to leave, because I was already pissed off and wouldn't enjoy myself. They agreed and we went to a charming, but less crowded Italian place across the street, where we were warmly welcomed and well looked after.
My experience was in 2018 …. invited by friends who had purchased the “full on” FL experience at a Napa-connected charity auction. Bottom line for me (and the whole group, all “foodies” - how I hate that term): Food: 6.5; Service: 9.8; Wine and wine service: 9.5; Ambience: 7.5. What was obviously disappointing was the food —- salty, cloying and very 1990’s (I’m 65-years old plus, so this is not a millennial put-down …). My honest impression was that the food had become a complacent caricature of its old self (ok, I get it, Keller has to offer his “classics”, but ….), and a lazy entrant in the new day’s culinary cutting edge. The best dishes of the night were not the classics, but those with the imprint of that era’s (2018) chef de cuisine. I would not go back. I really enjoy Bouchon (sorry to disagree with another commenter, but the steak frites are first-rate ….) and Ad Hoc depending on the menu. Those are the lasting Keller concepts worthy of your $$ if you find yourself in Yountville.
So much pressure to perform on the restaurant's end, I'd imagine. Where's the fun in that? And on the customer's end, it's too expensive for most people to find enjoyable.
If you don't find it the best meal ever, you've failed, the restaurant has failed, or everyone has failed together.
Give me a server who makes me feel welcome, a dining room in which I can hear my companions, and some lovely food that doesn't bankrupt me made by a chef who doesn't insist upon being worshipped. That's what makes this guy a happy fellow.
I have a friend who took her mother to the French Laundry for dinner, and they enjoyed it, yes, but they realized that for the price of the dinner, they could spend a month in a small apartment in Paris (this was some years ago). And so they did just that. And that’s what I would do instead. Glad you enjoyed the meal.
My God you can write! I have gone completely off going to restaurants with only a tasting menu. No I do not want your mushroom lying on the moss of Mayo with the tears from a goat from Croagh Patrick I just went well cooked normal food. The only subtraction is you forget the name of the woman. I feel there is more there
It’s now illegal for a restaurant in California to serve foie gras. That is as it should be.
I enjoyed dining out like this in my former life, but the reverence was always a turnoff. Food should be joyful! As for waitstaff, the truly well trained server is invisible until her or his input is needed. That fuss over the check was inexcusable.
There’s a small exception here in San Francisco due to a few restaurants operating in The Presidio, which is federal land. I have no idea if any of them serve foie gras, because I’m basically uninterested in eating any.
Had always thought of trying to get a reservation at FL but ultimately decided I’d probably be disappointed. Ended up eating at Bouchon once in Yountville and although billed as classic bistro the meal was just fair. If you can’t even do steak frites well, the odds of being wowed at FL seemed low. Thanks for writing a lovely story.
Oh man, I love The Loved One. Rayon chafes. I was never prouder of my goddaughter than when she told me she had scored a job as a memorials adviser at the Golders Green Crematorium.
Have you ever seen The Trip? You and Jack doing your impersonations of Anthony Blanche reminded me of the regular impersonation duels over dinner in this show. Here's an example. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygxEPkufryI - in this clip they are alone in the dining room but they regularly do this kind of schtick in crowded ones. They don't give a monkey's!
I am fans of both Brydon and Coogan, so I don't have to click on the link to know what it is. Of course that doesn't mean I won't click on it because it's just so delightful.
Known & worked with guys like TK for 40 years. They put on their pants… but then invent the culinary equivalent of the zipper, when the rest of us were fumbling with buttons. The joy of these years has been to see the country find those magical zippers on jeans as well as velvet trousers.
I felt it was an apt way to describe the fact that there are so many chefs who decide to show off their culinary junk and don’t realize that restraint is by far the better path.
I had to wait a week and read this again before commenting.
When I worked in the dining room at TFL [not FL] the service was intentionally reserved but personality encouraged. This was in years 3 and 4 ['96-97.] When I was working front [menu prez and order taking] I gave everything I had and put my heart and soul into it. Expectations were high, but there were no Michelin stars. There were a few good print reviews and the customers mostly were true diners who came for a great experience.
Even if you are highly experienced and have eaten all over, unless you've worked in a place like TFL, it's not easy to understand the choices that have to be made to run that restaurant and why. I have not eaten there since 1999, so I can't say exactly what the experience would be like today.
A few thoughts:
1. Corkage. If you could imagine the absolute torture we were put through by locals, wine makers, the famous and the wannabe famous who would show up with 10 wines for 4 people and expect to have corkage waived. And to have us clean 40 fancy wine glasses to boot. It was a nightmare for the managers to decide who paid, how many fees to charge etc,...Corkage was $10 IIRC. So eventually, they went to a fixed price, no VIP corkage fees waived. If you look at the cost of storing a wine list like theirs, you'd see they can't afford to have you bring your own wine and open it for free.
2. I've heard this has changed, but in my time, there was no music. The ambience was only the noise of the customers and service staff. Early in the service this made some diners uncomfortable. If like those seated near you [you were on table 8 in the small room I think with two other small tables] were having a bad patch in their relationship or in over their heads, it could affect your experience negatively. Thankfully sounds like some people got some wine down in the main dining room and things loosened up. The impact on your experience may not have.
3. How many restaurants like TFL have been open for 30 years? Or even the 20 when you were there? Some choices need to be made about consistency vs innovation. Thomas will feature new dishes from his cooks, but stays close to tradition. I would want Oysters and Pearls and Tongue and Cheek if I go back next year...
4. If you eat the bread, you are doomed to not enjoy much from the cheese course on....I know it's difficult because it's so good. I used to warn people.
5. Fact: even if you understand what they're doing, it doesn't mean you'll have a transcendent experience. I'd love to go back in the future, now that I've been out of restaurants for a long time and see how I feel.
Thanks for the encouraging, humorous and sincere take on your visit. I would still encourage anyone who is interested and can afford it to have a go.
John - You've tossed out a bunch of fantastic industry insights here! This is downright fantastic.
Makes sense about the corkage fee. The unwritten rule (or so I thought) was that if you bring a bottle of your own wine to a restaurant, it had to be REALLY f&^%ing special for a special occasion. This is NEVER intended to be a BYOB situation. Sounds like the 10-wines thing was a true abuse of an older custom. I'll have to ask some of my somm friends what the current state of corkage is for FOH. But I would NOT want to have to polish 40 wine glasses. Ugh. Kill me now. Thanks, John. - Seth ✦
Lordy, the number of Riedel glasses I've polished over the years is an embarrassingly high one.
Thanks for the very thoughtful comment, John. I appreciate the perspective.
OMG. You went to the Good Place. Yet, it sounded like it was a Mediocre Place. I always wanted to go, Michael! Sorry to hear that FOH was all Stepford, which sounds creepy. Brilliant call on the Austrian Riesling, but the $50 corkage fee AFTER already ordering from the wine menu was a complete party foul. You were there during its heyday, and hopefully even the mediocre and unsettling memories were priceless. Bravo and thanks for sharing this with the rest of us -- especially those like myself who are 3,000 miles away from Yountville. - Seth ✦
See my comment about corkage why it's the way it is. They have to clean Riedel now too I believe.
I think I was more annoyed about the fact that I had gotten Keller & Cann Hamilton a last minute table at our very busy restaurant, where their meal was fully comped without so much as a "thank you" than anything.
My annoyance about the corkage ultimately wasn't about the corkage at all.
I completely understand that.
I once called Larry Nadeau, long time M’aitre d’ at TFL, to arrange a reservation for a colleague and some business guests on short notice. It was the one and only time I used that connection and asked for a favor. Larry somehow accommodated it on an oversold weekend night.
They no-call, no-showed. And I found out from Larry directly. The colleague brushed me off like it was nothing and didn’t apologize.
I am still mad at him today, almost 15 years later.
Oh, wow. What a terrible person (I’m putting it mildly here). And incredibly generous on your part to use such a connection, John. Yeeeeesh. I’d still be pissed too. You just don’t pull that sort of stunt, no matter what. - Seth ✦
I don’t blame you one bit.
Will do, John. - Seth ✦
Hey, if I can squeeze a story out of something, it's good in the long run.
Why, now I've read that and I don't need to go! Thank yew! (If you ever come here though, Dakar! Worth the money plus you get to say "Dakar" like that NPR reporter.)
I'll only go if I get to wear Drakar Noir.
Noooo!
"When we visit, we pack our emotional baggage full of inflated expectations and drag it behind us through the little garden and across the front door’s threshold. It is the one thing the hostess who greets you is unable to check."
THIS. Perfection.
And not at all uniformally predictable.
Thx for a great read Michael ..
Thanks, Allison. I'm rather fond of that paragraph. xo
Someone needed to burst this blister and I am so glad it was you. For the record, though I don't make a habit of visiting these gastroshrines, I did eat at 11 Madison Park a few years ago when it was at its peak, and the waiters were so intuitive and responsive -- they picked up that we had a sense of irony and genuinely had fun with that (the giggles increased with each course), while expertly engaging on an entirely different plane with the neighboring table. No matter how good the food is, the service is ultimately why one spends the extra $$$ on such places. No disrespect to the waitstaff, but management has to set the expectations. Thank you for nailing the tail on the donkey.
It was a juicy blister to lance, to put it in delicious culinary terms.
To no one's surprise, I fully agree with you about service. Years ago, I went with some friends to The Flying Saucer, a very trendy spot in the 90s. We stood at the front desk for minutes as the hostess gave us the stink eye and continued chatting with a co-worker. I told my companions I wanted to leave, because I was already pissed off and wouldn't enjoy myself. They agreed and we went to a charming, but less crowded Italian place across the street, where we were warmly welcomed and well looked after.
Three guesses as to who got our repeat business.
My experience was in 2018 …. invited by friends who had purchased the “full on” FL experience at a Napa-connected charity auction. Bottom line for me (and the whole group, all “foodies” - how I hate that term): Food: 6.5; Service: 9.8; Wine and wine service: 9.5; Ambience: 7.5. What was obviously disappointing was the food —- salty, cloying and very 1990’s (I’m 65-years old plus, so this is not a millennial put-down …). My honest impression was that the food had become a complacent caricature of its old self (ok, I get it, Keller has to offer his “classics”, but ….), and a lazy entrant in the new day’s culinary cutting edge. The best dishes of the night were not the classics, but those with the imprint of that era’s (2018) chef de cuisine. I would not go back. I really enjoy Bouchon (sorry to disagree with another commenter, but the steak frites are first-rate ….) and Ad Hoc depending on the menu. Those are the lasting Keller concepts worthy of your $$ if you find yourself in Yountville.
I visibly tense up if anyone should call me a “foodie.”
I’m not sure if I’ll ever find myself in Yountville again, but even a so-so steak frites is ok with me!
I envy you for having a friend named Lyle. I've yet to meet that benchmark.
You never forget your first Lyle.
I don't know how an establishment like The French Laundry could ever possibly live up to the hype. I appreciate your review. Thanks. Love, Virg
So much pressure to perform on the restaurant's end, I'd imagine. Where's the fun in that? And on the customer's end, it's too expensive for most people to find enjoyable.
If you don't find it the best meal ever, you've failed, the restaurant has failed, or everyone has failed together.
Give me a server who makes me feel welcome, a dining room in which I can hear my companions, and some lovely food that doesn't bankrupt me made by a chef who doesn't insist upon being worshipped. That's what makes this guy a happy fellow.
I have a friend who took her mother to the French Laundry for dinner, and they enjoyed it, yes, but they realized that for the price of the dinner, they could spend a month in a small apartment in Paris (this was some years ago). And so they did just that. And that’s what I would do instead. Glad you enjoyed the meal.
Oh god, I'd use that money for Paris rent, too.
My God you can write! I have gone completely off going to restaurants with only a tasting menu. No I do not want your mushroom lying on the moss of Mayo with the tears from a goat from Croagh Patrick I just went well cooked normal food. The only subtraction is you forget the name of the woman. I feel there is more there
Thank you, Larissa.
I once went to a place where each of the twelve courses related to a line in a poem and it was exhausting.
Yeah, it’s weird about the woman. She was Jack’s date. She barely spoke, but I think was quite agreeable. I can’t even remember what she looks like!
Was Jack the undertake………
Ye.........s.
It’s now illegal for a restaurant in California to serve foie gras. That is as it should be.
I enjoyed dining out like this in my former life, but the reverence was always a turnoff. Food should be joyful! As for waitstaff, the truly well trained server is invisible until her or his input is needed. That fuss over the check was inexcusable.
There’s a small exception here in San Francisco due to a few restaurants operating in The Presidio, which is federal land. I have no idea if any of them serve foie gras, because I’m basically uninterested in eating any.
Ugh, what hypocrisy to serve it in federal land!
You may have inspired me to resuscitate my own post about the French Laundry.
Do it, Sean. Give that post the breath of life.
I had to do some serious spelunking, but I found it!
I had to go into the way, way, waaaaaaaayback machine to find mine. I look forward to reading yours.
I had to go into the way, way, waaaaaaaayback machine to find mine. I look forward to reading yours.
My original post will turn 20 years old on Friday.
Had always thought of trying to get a reservation at FL but ultimately decided I’d probably be disappointed. Ended up eating at Bouchon once in Yountville and although billed as classic bistro the meal was just fair. If you can’t even do steak frites well, the odds of being wowed at FL seemed low. Thanks for writing a lovely story.
My brain keeps reading "FL" as Florida and all I can think is "Why would anyone want to make a reservation to eat in Florida?
I think I'm more or less over ultra-fine dining. I much prefer enjoying my food to worshipping it.
Oh man, I love The Loved One. Rayon chafes. I was never prouder of my goddaughter than when she told me she had scored a job as a memorials adviser at the Golders Green Crematorium.
Have you ever seen The Trip? You and Jack doing your impersonations of Anthony Blanche reminded me of the regular impersonation duels over dinner in this show. Here's an example. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygxEPkufryI - in this clip they are alone in the dining room but they regularly do this kind of schtick in crowded ones. They don't give a monkey's!
I am fans of both Brydon and Coogan, so I don't have to click on the link to know what it is. Of course that doesn't mean I won't click on it because it's just so delightful.
And OMG I so want to visit that crematorium!
Known & worked with guys like TK for 40 years. They put on their pants… but then invent the culinary equivalent of the zipper, when the rest of us were fumbling with buttons. The joy of these years has been to see the country find those magical zippers on jeans as well as velvet trousers.
I like the way you see the world in terms of pants fasteners, MSN.
And I do know what you mean.
I felt it was an apt way to describe the fact that there are so many chefs who decide to show off their culinary junk and don’t realize that restraint is by far the better path.
I very much enjoyed it.